The old "how many left" chestnut

[MGBV8]

Whilst perusing the web, inevitably you come across the old chestnut "there's only 600 Marina's left" over and over again.
Frankly, I don't believe this in the slightest. I suspect there are probably, many, many more survivors that pre date the DVLA computer system.
The data on the "how many left" website is wildly inaccurate as confirmed by the Austin 7 owners club and indeed the MG car club.

To substantiate my theory; As my moniker probably gives away, aside from Marina's, I'm also quite into MGB GT Factory V8's and currently own two examples. The how many left website purports there to be only 524 MGB GT V8's left of a production run of 2601. However, the V8 register of the MG car club knows of 1969 surviving examples and the vast majority of these cars (1649 examples) are still located in the UK.

So what does this mean? Well in the case of MGB GT V8's the data is less than 30% accurate for starters. If the DVLA have managed to lose track of some 1000 examples of an incredibly rare car, the mind boggles as to how many cars could still be unaccounted for from such a heavily mass produced car such as the Marina.

Whilst I do not doubt that the attrition rate for Marina's is extremely high, I seriously doubt it's as bad as is made out to be. The DVLA record of surviving marinas is roughly the same number as MGB GT V8's, so it stands to reason that there is likely to be just as many, if not considerably more cars, which have slipped under the radar. To that end, I would suggest that the actual number of surviving cars is more likely to be in excess of 2000 examples?

Thoughts?

[ScreamingLordStokes]

I agree with you that there are probably a lot more left than the DVLA computer says Jon. The Jubilee that has just sold is a good example, as Paul says, it was last taxed in 1993 so could, in theory, have slipped off the DVLA register. However, I suppose it could work the other way and some of the Marina's that have been broken for parts could still be thought to exist, so who knows?

[balmy]

I was given 'evidence' that about 1000 marinas exist. Still haven't had time to look into it further yet!

[MarinaCoupe]

The key unknown is where the DVLA have records of cars built between 1971 & 1984 but no model name, so something with say a 1275 engine could be one of a number of cars, Marina, Mini, and then later on Metro as well.

I have an extract from the DVLA database on an Excel spreadsheet.







Chris
www.marinacoupe.co.uk

[italsi]

What you have to remember as well is that when these cars were new - It was up to the dealer to record the vehicle against the VRM / VIN. If the person at the dealer had lots to do / aug 1st cars as it was then mistakes happen while ever you have a person recording the details.
As has been previously said if that model has the wrong make model trim (if any trim recorded at all) then these will not show on the 'how many left' that sites works for all those that had the data recorded when new correctly.
I have had numerous vehicles in the past including a SInger Chamois that had the first part of the VIN recorded as 13 - the car had been off the road years and I put it back on the road with the new mot computer it woudn't recognise it. Luckily I had a list of all the previous log books from DVLA and it showed when it got listed on the new system in 1977 that someone read the correct part of the VIN 'B' as '13' due to the way the original person wrote the VIN. Various letters / pictures later and the VIN was amended.

I also own an Anglia Van and that listed on the log book as Ford 'special vehicle' I suspect it used to belong to the army although I never got to the bottom of it..

I suspect the same will apply to the MG and suspect if you had all the 1600 + log books in front of you the majority may not even show GT or V8 etc. Loads and loads of Escorts are simply listed as Escort saloon (my mates is and it's a genuine Mexico just dosn't say it on the log book. although all the VINS say it is- plus he's owned it since it was 4 year old so knows lots of the history) As for Marinas again I suspect lots will simply be listed as Morris saloon 1.3 as previously mentioned.

Due to the way the system is managed the 'how many left' site will get better (for the newer cars) but it will always have these old 'errors' in

[Viscount Orange Biscuit]

DVLA make a mistake..Shook Horror imposible lol i spend all day working in insurance and you wouldn't belive what DVLA puts some cars down as lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOdjCb4LwQY

But DVLA Dont make mistakes do they lol

i hope the figures are wrong so there will be more Marinas for us to find and bring back to life..

[jiversteve]

Just to add to the debate, there are a few Marlins running around still registered as Morris Marinas especially when they are still on the original plates.

I am not sure about the legality of the registration as they are clearly not Marinas but presumably they met the requirements when built in the 80's.

[locost_bryan]

One of the challenges is that anything that was hand written, was likely to be read wrong. The dealer scribbles something down on the form, and the DVLA clerk makes a best guess at what the chicken scratchings vaguely resemble. :roll:

When I did a similar exercise with the NZ records, I had to look under Makes for Austin, Morris and Leyland, and under Model for anything that began "Marin" or included 1500, 1750, 1700, 1.7, TC, 400, 575 or 262. :shock: :roll:

The engine and chassis numbers were even worse.

[PHUQ]

I reckon the overall Marina numbers are probably a bit more accurate than for the MGB GT, simply because a lot of GTs would simply be on the database as MGB, or Make: MG, Model BGT etc etc, where searching MGB GT won't give a "hit". Make: Morris, Model: Marina is harder to get wrong! Still not exactly accurate though. It's when it comes down to splitting body types & trim levels it really falls apart- for example I suspect I probably have one of the last handful of Mk1 SDL Estates on the road but there's no real way of telling from the records.

That's assuming that when the database is searched for Morris Marina it manages to pick up "Morris Marina DL Coupe" of course.

[jiversteve]

Unfortunately in 1971 pre computers, with manual databases, you could not drill down into the data as it was dependant on individuals.
Today numbers can be crunched and data can be drilled down to a much greater extent.
But we are still left with the rule,
Crap in = More crap out.

Te real answer will never be known. We can only guess.